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Post by heyzeus7 on Jan 20, 2010 1:30:02 GMT -5
Hi everyone,
First of all thank you to Jeff Messerman for creating this forum. Just what I needed as a writer just starting off! To get things rolling on the loglines thread I have a few of my own that I'd like comments on:
(Untitled horror project): "Thrown in a maximum security prison for a crime he didn't commit, a young man must fend off the aggressive recruitment efforts of a vampire coven planning to break out and wreak havoc on the outside world."
Hard Money: "When down-on-his-luck college grad Steve White wins the mega-lottery, he struggles to find his place in the world of the super-rich and must deal with Charles Redd, a former billionaire who wants to use Steve's new-found wealth to take revenge on the rival who destroyed his fortune."
(Untitled comedy project): "After telling all his friends that he and a hot girl he saw across the street are now in a relationship, the normally shy and romantically frustrated Brendan must summon the courage to make the relationship real before the ruse is up."
Thoughts? Suggestions?
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Post by thiagodaher on Jan 20, 2010 8:51:18 GMT -5
here we go man... english is not my mother language, so excuse any mistake i make.
horror: i'm not a fan of vampire films, so please, take my opinion lightly. i can't see the relation between the protagonist locked up for a crime he didn't commit and the fact he is being recruited to do some evil with the vampire coven. the prison story might get the attention of the audience, and they'll never forgive you for not giving them answers and just developing the vampire storyline. what could be interesting, is if the guy is really a criminal. it could generate an interesting internal conflict since even as a criminal, he doesn't want to side with the vampires. of course i don't know the script and you might approach some of these issues in it. this is what i could gather from this particular logline.
hard money: you really had me at the beginning, but when you introduced the secondary character and his goal you kinda lost me. what i thought was: how cool is the fact this guy is now a millionaire but can't seem to find he's place in this world. that could be a great dramedy (of course, this all happened in my mind) and you could finish off showing us that we don't need all that to be happy. what bothered me is: how could a former billionaire be friends with a down-on-his-luck college grad? and how in the world would he use that little money (millions against billions) to avenge himself against this other rich guy? and why would steve give the money to him? once again, i don't know the script, and you didn't mention the genre your going for, so if it's an all and out comedy or a dark thriller/drama the revenge story might work. if it's lighter fare i would recommend losing the billionaire.
comedy: i like this one. nothing that mind-blowing regarding the story per se, but if the characters are strong and the pace is right, it could work very well. i would give a more in-depth opinion only after reading the script. this one has the benefit of the doubt.
cheers, thiago.
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Post by Jeff Messerman on Jan 20, 2010 9:15:22 GMT -5
Hey Zeus! ;D (your handle cracks me up!) You call yourself a "writer just starting off," well I gotta' tell ya', you're off to a great start. 1. (untitled horror project) - y'know, like a lot of people, I'm completely tired of vampires. At this point, if it ain't Bela Lugosi, I'm not interested. That said, I think this idea is brilliant. Putting the only person in the know about an impending vampire invasion BEHIND BARS is a stroke of genius. Since this vampire popularity wave ain't going anywhere anytime soon, I would hit the ground running on this one ASAP, y'know? Two more Twilight movies (or three???) coming down the pike, should give a nice window of opportunity, eh? 2. HARD MONEY - You're close on this one. I get a great sense of character and tone, but the Charles Redd angle is a bit unclear to me. Nonetheless, please keep developing this one because it sounds really promising too. Would this be a comedy-drama or just straight-up comedy? 3. (untitled comedy project) - This one sells itself, man. Brendan's plight is one that any guy can empathize with and your logline evokes numerous comedic possibilities. You could literally spend the whole first act on him setting up this hilarious ruse of trying to seem in relationship mode with this "hot girl." All three have great potential man. I would say your most pressing problem at this point is picking and choosing which one to strike on. (My vote would be the prison-vamp flick, if only because of the bloodsucker's high cultural standing at this time). Thanks for posting those, enjoyable stuff! (plus the more loglines I read, the better... I rather suck at them)
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Post by heyzeus7 on Jan 20, 2010 11:00:40 GMT -5
Thank you, Thiago and Jeff for your kind words and helpful comments!
Thiago:
You have a very good point about the protagonist perhaps being a criminal. It's something that crossed my mind but the way you put it makes it more compelling. That just might be the way to go. I originally wanted the hero to be a non-criminal because then the reality of prison would be doubly horrifying, both because he's never been in there before and because of the vamps. I'll have to think more about it.
As for the former billionaire in 'Hard Money', my idea was that this is a very former billionaire, as in he lost his whole fortune and is now actually living on the streets (I've read about this happening, actually). He sort of loiters around near where Steve works and the two of them have an uneasy rapport well before Steve wins the lottery. But I agree with you and Jeff, this seems to be the weakest logline of the three.
Jeff: Thanks so much for the encouragement, I'm glad you liked the loglines...Actually I can't take credit for my username, I got it from Samuel Jackson's character in 'Die Hard 3', Zeus Carver. When he and John McClane first meet John thinks his name is 'Jesus' because when people address him they say 'Hey, Zeus!'. I loved that scene and I've been using Heyzeus as an online moniker ever since.
Thanks again! Thanks again!
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Post by pic on Jan 20, 2010 15:39:09 GMT -5
Hi hezyeus7,
I also get an immediate sense of an interesting protagonist thrown into a situation with strong conflicting forces with all 3. 'Refinement' is the keyword for me.
Horror; what 'young man'? In Hard Money, you describe the protagonist with two attributes. That would help here. Vampires are a cliche and hard to make interesting nowadays. Could you exchange him with a more interesting supernatural force? Ideally one that symbolizes the hero's inter conflict. Someone who takes 'being free' to illegal limits maybe, to counterpoint the hero's prison situation.
Hard Money: All good, especial interesting setup. Someone without money who gets lots, and someone who had lots who now has none, but wants to again have lots etc. Very interesting conflict scenario opening up all kinds of interesting possibilities. I wonder if you can add a hint to an interesting climax at the end where someone will only gain lots if he gives up lots. (That might give away too much, all right). Of all three this one seems to be fleshed out in our own mind the most, resulting in a log line that has the most flesh of all three. I'd start writing this one.
Comedy: 'hot girl' is stereotype and could use more flesh. A beauty queen winner? The girl of his dreams? (I'd prefer she symbolizes his inner need, instead of just having big boobs). Maybe she is the star sales woman, and he is the sales guy at the bottom of the list, explained by his shyness. (would be nice to have a play on 'shy/not shy' in here, just as you have one with 'have/have no wealth'. The dream women could be the extroverted, him the introverted etc. Again this one still seems flat and without details and doesn't immediately create such a world in my mind as does Hard Money.
All in all great concepts, though, with lots of interesting conflict potential. If you can flesh stereotypes like the vampire or the hot girl into real people, it should work.
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Post by attatt on Jan 20, 2010 15:57:42 GMT -5
I love horror movies and never get tired of vampires, zombies, or anything else if the story is told well. I say keep going on this on ASAP as long as you are able to deliver on the promise of a great amount of terror and struggle for the human inmate. I like the idea that being innocent will make it all the more terrifying for him, but I also see value in making him an all out criminal so that no human on the outside, or inside, will ever consider listening to him about the impending vampire uprising. If he is a bad ass, you also have the option of making him a key piece in stopping the whole thing. An innocent guy would be less believable if the story goes that way.
Hard Money is a good idea, but I agree that the billionare angle is a bit weak. Maybe the idea is good, just doesnt come out right in the logline. I know that is an issue a million writers have had.
The comedy idea is solid. I hope you can deliver a solid script to back it up. I wouldnt say that the hot girl needs a hook like beauty queen to sell it. We have all seen regular girls who are just hot and wondered if we are in their league or have the moves to creat that initial spark. This is one idea where casting will be super important. If you write a perfect script, bad casting could kill it. If you write a mediocre script, great casting could send it over the top.
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Post by heyzeus7 on Jan 20, 2010 19:02:15 GMT -5
Thanks pic and attatt, very insightful and helpful comments.
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Post by mahmoud on Jan 23, 2010 6:57:39 GMT -5
Hey Zeus...
The premise of the untitled Horror is very interesting...
If you add stuff like that the prison the young man in is used to conceal the vampires from the people that would make it spicy.. The conflict that you put here is great... The vampires offer help to the young man by breaking him out in exchange for helping them... So the man has too choose between freedom or rotting in prison for the rest of his life. Moral Dilemma will raise the quality of the script..
Keep writing...
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Post by attatt on Jan 26, 2010 15:02:38 GMT -5
The potential for being proven innocent weighed against breaking out which is going to increase his sentence if caught is also a good conflict. I would probably not be thinking about that while dealing with menacing vampires though. Maybe that is a bit too much to ask
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Post by mscherer on Jan 28, 2010 6:45:22 GMT -5
heyzues7,
I would agree with Jeff that having the only person in the world who knows about this pending doom locked up behind bars is a brilliant idea. Well done. However, I do have two questions: 1. is this young man capable of preventing the break out? 2. how do the authorities keep a coven of vampires at bay, or, don’t they know they exist?
And, I have two suggestions: 1. drop the ‘Thrown in a maximum security prison for a crime he didn’t commit…’. (a) it doesn’t change the fact that this guy is behind bars, and (b) it can be brought out in the script early on to foster sympathy for your hero. 2. Rather than have him up against ‘a vampire coven’ – is coven the right word? Makes me think of witches – make the antagonist the leader of the vampires. If your hero can defeat him, he saves the world.
That said, here is my SWAG at your logline: A young convict uncovers plans for a prison break only to learn the prisoners involved are vampires hell-bent on wreaking havoc on an unsuspecting world.
Keep up the good work and keep writing!
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Post by mscherer on Jan 28, 2010 7:05:37 GMT -5
heyzeus7,
Okay, two things strike me right off: 1. you use character names in your logline. Know this is my own personal opinion, but… don’t. I’m 99.9% sure your characters will have different names by the time your film hits the silver screen. 2. I think you have two stories going on in this logline: (a) down and out college grad wins mega lottery – how does he react, cope, etc. This is one possible story. And (b) bitter ex-billionaire out for revenge against those who destroyed his fortune.
A few what-ifs: 1. what if young college grad gets in trouble with his new-found wealth and bitter ex-billionaire tries to mentor the kid. 2. what if bitter ex-billionaire becomes torn between helping this kid, and scamming this innocent out of his money – like he had been, maybe he lost his money in a Bernie Madoff type scam. 3. what if bitter ex-billionaire learns that college kid is his son from a long ago one night stand – I know, been done before, but we’re brainstorming here. 4. what if they decide to team up and together run a scam, using the kid’s money, and bring down the perpetrators of the Ponzi scheme?
Then you could run with a logline like:
After winning a mega lottery an unemployed college grad teams with a bitter ex-billionaire to bring down a Madoff-like ponzi scheme.
Some thoughts. Mileage might vary. Batteries not included. Read the fine print.
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Post by mscherer on Jan 28, 2010 7:30:03 GMT -5
heyzeus7,
Okay, I get your story from your logline, but it seems a bit cumbersome and unwieldy. Also, I don’t see a clear antagonist in your story. When writing a logline you must include the following – again, only one man’s opinion: Protagonist. Antagonist. Situation. Stakes. Also, don’t use character names. That said:
1. What if the antagonist isn’t the school jock, or the rich kid – all been done a million times before. 2. What if the antagonist is the kid’s father? A father who grew up geeky and gangly and awkward and would be jealous if his son landed the hottest babe in the neighborhood. 3. What if the father has a crush on this girl too? – American Beauty comes to mind. 4. What if you make the environment a college campus?
Now you have an antagonist and one not usually seen in such comedies. You could then have a logline like:
A romantically challenged college student struggles to hook up with the hottest girl on campus only to run up against some stiff competition – his own father.
My two-cents – just babbling with my keyboard.
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